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Question About SPC And Wine In Sausage

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 21:00
by sawhorseray
Got a great deal on pork butt and pork loins yesterday, 15 pounds of each. The pork loins are soaking up CW's Canadian bacon brine solution in the fridge after being injected with 10% of their weight with the marinating needle, scheduled to go into the smoker Monday morning.

I'm going to take my shot at making some Kolbaz the next couple of days, recipe as follows

15 lbs pork butt
2 cups Royal Tokaji wine
5 - tbsp salt
7 - tbsp paprika
2 - tbsp cayanne (my idea)
2 & 1/2 tbsp ground allspice
2 - tbsp black pepper
15-20 cloves fresh garlic, minced
1 - tbsp Insatcure #1

I'm tossing around the idea of throwing a couple of tablespoons each of fennel and corriander seeds, toasted then run thru the grinder a bit. My question is, do I need to incorporate some soy protien concentrate as a binder, and if so, how much? I'm going to smoke this sausage with alder wood, heavily. Thanks, RAY

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 21:38
by ssorllih
That amount of wine is withing the liquid addition quantities that are used without adding binders.

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 02:31
by sawhorseray
Thanks for that Ross, then I guess I'm good to go. I'm a little nervous about this batch because the two cups of wine cost me over $24. That a bit much to be dumping into sausage, but that's what Len Poli's recipe called for

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 02:41
by crustyo44
Hi Ray,
Make sure you only use genuine Hungarian paprika powder, any others are sub-standard.
Let us all know how they turn out, Hungarian smoked sausage is my favourite fare.
Good luck Mate.
Regards,
Jan.

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 02:51
by ssorllih
Ray , At that price I would drink that wine and use some non discript California rotgot in the sausage. :lol:

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 03:32
by Chuckwagon
Hi Ray,
You wrote:
My question is, do I need to incorporate some soy protien concentrate as a binder, and if so, how much?
Soy Protein Concentrate and non-fat, dry milk powder are limited commercially to 3-1/2 %. In any sausage, a concentration of more than 5% is not recommended because it affects the flavor in amounts higher than that. Some say it is a "beany" taste. A cup and a half in ten pounds of sausage is a good place to start. SPC and NFDM should not be used in semi-dry cured or fully-dry cured sausages because they hold the moisture in the sausage - the very thing you are trying not to do in dry-cured sausages.
I agree with Ross when it comes to adding wine or vinegar to sausage - don`t... or at least use it in very low concentrations as both unravel proteins.

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 06:10
by sawhorseray
ssorllih wrote:Ray , At that price I would drink that wine and use some non discript California rotgot in the sausage. :lol:
I agree, and unless it's the best thing I've ever tasted I doubt I'll make it again. For the money I spent on that stupid bottle of wine I could've bought a bottle of Glenfiddich and been fairly happy for a couple of evenings. I want this to come out fairly garlicy, spicy, and smoky, so I'll just go with the spices I listed and forget the fennel and other stuff, hope the cayanne works out for me. I'm looking for Snagman's garlic recipe and will try to incorporaste that into this batch when I find it. I'm thinking to grind everything tomorrow thru 7mm plate and let it sit in the fridge overnight with all the spices but the wine and cure, then run it all thru Friday morning with the 4.5 mm plate, mix it with the wine and instacure and stuff into 35mm hog casings. I have to move my brining pork loins into a marine cooler full of ice whice doing the sausage, this is starting to look a lot more like work than I tend to care for. If it comes out great I'll be a hero, if not I'll give it to in-laws for Xmas presents. Either way it's win-win! RAY

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 06:14
by sawhorseray
This is the recipe I'm kind of trying to follow. Why the guy won't let anything be copied and pasted is beyond me, it's not like he wroye Gone with the Wind or something.

http://lpoli.50webs.com/index_files/Kol ... garian.pdf

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 06:30
by crustyo44
Hi Ray,
I have been making Snagmans csabai for a long time, total production is already well over 50 kilos with alterations to suit my taste.
The 5 kg batch I made, had double the amount of Hungarian sweet and hot paprika in it as well a 2 tablespoons of chilli flakes, 3 llarge heads of garlic (poached and softened in some filtered water)
They were smoked over 3 days with a spell at night and finished up a nice dark red/brown colour with a smell and taste to die for.
Oops, the last 2 words might haver gone a bit too far, but you know what I mean.
I usually mix all the spices, salt, garlic and its water in a vitamiser for a short time and than I mix this with the cubed meat to resty in the fridge for 48 hours. Grind and stuff.
The resting of the spiced cubed meat (without the fat) seems to increase the flavour profile.
Give it a go Mate.
Best of Luck.
Jan.

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 23:47
by sawhorseray
After I read CW's 32 tips last night I was about ready to toss the entire affair aside and just make something else, I was in direct conflict with tip #19, using a sweet, fruity dessert wine. I tossed and turned and thought about the fact I already had the spices measured and mixed, and I already had that stupid bottle of expensive dessert wine that I was never going to drink. Then I figured what the heck, Napa is just a hours drive away from me and if the recipe sucks I can just go there and throw a rock thru Len Poli's window. I got up at 4am and did some coffee for a couple of hours while plotting my course of action, then set up shop.

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Managed to get the pork butt de-boned in fine fashion without drawing any of my own blood, then started chopping up the two knobs of garlic. Not really used to playing with sharp knives at that hour of the morning, had to pay strict attention to what I was doing.

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I ran the pork thru the coarse plate of my grinder, tossed it in the meat mixer with the Tokaji wine, spice and cure mixture for a three minute tumble, then ran it all thru the grinder again with the 4.5mm plate. Had it back in the fridge in under ten minutes total time, cleaned everything up, and then took a break to watch the mighty SF Giants resume their march to the World Series. I'm a 3rd generation SF native and live and die with the Giants and Niners.

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After the game I got everything stuffed and linked up, placed on the smoking rods and stting in the cooler waiting for the morning.

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This refrigeration method sits right at 40° and I can rotate and replace the ice jugs indefinately. I'll be smokin' early! RAY

Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 05:40
by Gulyás
Hi Ray.

They are beautiful sausages. I like to use wider sticks, and also twist them a little, on one side of the stick one way, and the other side the other way. It works best if you do that before they harden. But then you also need more space.
Twisting them a little the same way on both side helps too.

Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 07:19
by Chuckwagon
Topic Split 10.13.12@00:18 by CW - (See Hyde Park)